Smear of Andre Carson

GOP Censorship (2.50 / 2)

I tried to post a link to this article on AdvanceIndiana but Gary Welsh exploded in anger about not permitting such links written by "anonymous nobodies". Gary's website is well-known as the go-to site for all Carson-haters who post lengthy anonymous screeds defaming Black elected Democrats.

Tyrion must have been too accurate for Gary's newly-found delicate sensibilities about anonymous blogging. He'll get over it and resume his usual frothing...

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by: Wilson46201 @ Wed Jan 23, 2008 at 18:43:35 PM CST

Okay, she invited Farakhan. (4.00 / 2)

Being that the funeral was quite obviously the opening event of his campaign, why did Andre let Farakhan show up?

And why did Ms. Carson want Farakhan there in the first place?

I have to say that I just don't get it.  What's the connection between Ms. Cason and Farakhan in the first place?

You know, the anti-semitism is just the tip of the iceberg with Farakhan.  He's just... nutty.  The numerology in particular is disturbing, very indicative of someone who doesn't have it all together.

I wonder if he could do it again, would Andre work harder to not have Farakhan there?  Other than that, his campaign is moving along pretty well.  You could chalk it up to a rookie mistake, but unless he learns from it, there will be more mistakes.

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by: Buzzcut @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 09:12:52 AM CST

It was a mistake -- (4.00 / 1)

And it is something he will have to answer for, but I don't think it should discredit his whole campaign if he can properly explain the situation and distance himself from the Nation of Islam.

More interesting to me in this piece was the Elrod website stuff. Gary's going to do what Gary does no matter what, but the Elrod/Miller connection is something that needs to be explored.

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by: Thomas @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 09:16:38 AM CST

[ Parent ]

IslamoFascist? (2.50 / 2)

http://ruthholladay.com/index....

I have posted this link repeatedly here and elsewhere. It explains André Carson's religious affiliations.

The diehard wingnuts still keep trying to holler (in essence) IslamoFascist at André Carson, the Democratic Party's nominee for the Special Election in the 7th District...

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by: Wilson46201 @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 10:07:06 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Think of it this way... (4.00 / 1)

Debunking urban myths the way that Andre has done often just reinforces those myths.

"If he needs to deny it, it must be true".

Look at what Obama has done to address the myth that he is secretly a Muslim.  That website he had just reinfoces the myth.

Some things are better left unsaid.  The "secret Muslim" thing is just beyond the pale.  Laughable.

What it probably boils down to is that the people that were going to vote for Andre wouldn't be detered by a Farakhan presence anyway.  The real question is, are the anti-Andre folks motivated by the connection?  It seems like they are.

I don't see a lot of vigorous defense of Andre by anybody here but Wilson.  That's probably not a good thing.

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by: Buzzcut @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 10:57:30 AM CST

[ Parent ]

And (3.00 / 3)

Wilson is a former employee of Julia Carson, so there's a personal connection there.  I'm telling you, there is a lot of anger with this choice among Democratic voters, particularly those not affiliated with the Center Township mafia.

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 11:16:59 AM CST

[ Parent ]

"Center Township mafia." (2.33 / 3)

After the drug-related murders on Hovey, for any Caucasian to sling such a slur at Black Democrats is despicable. Yes indeed there is organized crime, a mafia, but to link Julia Carson with shooting babies over dope deals is racist to the core.

Stop the "Center Township mafia" crap unless you are indeed referring to the organized narcotics dealers.  

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by: Wilson46201 @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 11:47:08 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Uhhh... (4.00 / 1)

Whatever, dude.

I prefer the term "machine" to "mafia".  No doubt that there is a political machine at work here.

One thing that both a machine and the mafia have in common is the passing on of the "family business" from one generation to the next.

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by: Buzzcut @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 12:40:55 PM CST

[ Parent ]

"Machine" (0.00 / 1)

is a perfectly acceptable and ancient label for a political organization. To label such a legitimate political organization a "mafia" however is to call it a wide-spread organized criminal enterprise. For a Caucasian to label a group of (mostly) African-American popularly-elected officials a "mafia" is racist to the core.

Julia Carson had one of the most progressive voting records in Congress: to call her political support system a gang of thugs, dope-dealers, pimps and murderers is reactionary to the core...

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by: Wilson46201 @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 13:00:49 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Don't project. (4.00 / 1)

Your linking of "mafia" to the carnage caused by drug rings, and further linking that to African Americans, is a defect in your own mind.

I'd be pretty careful about throwing around that racist label if I were you.  Some of us don't take kindly to the charge.

As to whether Ms. Carson's organization is a machine or not, the fact that her unqualified grandson has been made heir apparant over many more qualified individuals (Dr. O) is almost the definition of a machine.

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by: Buzzcut @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 14:38:08 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Proof of his unqualification... (0.00 / 0)

...was letting Farakhan show up at that funeral.

If David Duke was going to show up to my grandmother's funeral, I'd throw my body in front of the door to keep him from coming in.

"Evil is allowed to happen when good people do nothing"

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by: Buzzcut @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 14:41:45 PM CST

[ Parent ]

racism? (4.00 / 1)

I never once mentioned "black Democrats."  You are always bringing up Andre's race, and race in general.  And you are also making a HUGE assumption that I am Caucasian.

And "mafia" is also a term for a close-knit group of people with similar self-interests.

And Stallio, how about posting a comment, rather than simply down-rating, you coward.

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 14:48:27 PM CST

[ Parent ]

coward? (0.00 / 1)

you have a real attitude problem.  and that's a big part of why i keep down-rating your comments.

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by: stallio @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:50:52 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Well... (3.00 / 3)

I don't see a lot of vigorous defense of Andre by anybody here but Wilson.  That's probably not a good thing.

I've already made it clear how I feel about the blanket (and often misguided) generalizations that have been made about Andre, his faith, and his ability to serve.

I think there are plenty of questions that need to be answered by Andre himself in the next few weeks. Will the Farakhan thing need to be addressed? Sure.

Will the best explanation in the world appease those who view Islam as an inherently threatening religion? Nope.

It's something he'll have to deal with, but I personally haven't seen anything that implies to me that Andre's faith should factor in to anyone's decision in the 7th.

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by: Thomas @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 11:20:36 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Anti-Semite (0.00 / 0)

Take a look at his campaign literature...
His treasurer is Jewish.  Enough Said.

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by: zcockrum @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 11:26:36 AM CST

hahaha (0.00 / 0)

That's like saying "I'm not a racist, some of my best friends are black!"

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 14:49:08 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Except not really (0.00 / 0)

Cute, flawed analogies aside, Andre Carson is unequivocally not anti-semitic.

If he really were, explain why he would have a Jewish treasurer.

And while that may be easier to answer, why would a Jewish woman become his treasurer if he were anti-semitic?

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by: zcockrum @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 15:01:25 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Oh c'mon folks... (3.00 / 3)

Andre Carson isn't anti-semitic, and having a Jewish treasurer wouldn't prove anything if he was.

You're both right, and wrong, oddly enough.

I'm surprised you anti-Andre folks aren't pushing harder for David O. and the gang to start reaching out to folks. I sent him a request for an interview and he said yes, but I never heard from him again.

I would love it if we could dedicate some of this energy toward positive ends.

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by: Thomas @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 15:06:03 PM CST

[ Parent ]

If Farakhan hadn't showed up to that funeral... (2.00 / 2)

...anti-semitism wouldn't be an issue.

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by: Buzzcut @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 15:11:57 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I understand why you say that... (3.00 / 2)

...but I think you're wrong.

Tyrion addresses this well.

Should Andre have been asked about it? Yes.

Was he asked about it? Yes.

And from what it sounds like, he answered the question well enough. If he says he didn't have anything to do with it, your argument boils down to frantic cries that Andre is a liar.

There are many more avenues you folks could go down if you want to be critical of Andre's candidacy -- just as is the case with Elrod or anyone. Why not stick to the more substantial issues.

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by: Thomas @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:14:33 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I dont know.. (0.00 / 0)

I can't imagine that an anti-semite would have a Jewish treasurer...but call me a cynic...

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by: zcockrum @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 20:48:06 PM CST

[ Parent ]

ahem (0.00 / 0)

I'm not saying he is.  What I'm saying is that having a Jewish treasurer isn't "proof" of anything.

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:23:33 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Yo Buzzcut (3.50 / 4)

Hey Buzzcut,

You've written twice that Andre "let Farrakhan show up at the funeral," but that makes an enormous unwarranted assumption about Andre's control over the funeral arrangements.  Andre is only one of Julia's relatives and I don't think you or I or anyone else knows enough about the family dynamics to assume that Andre has some sort of unilateral control.  

Andre has been absolutely clear that he didn't invite Farrakhan and that he disagrees plainly with Farrakhan's religious perspective. If that doesn't satisfy you, I'm not sure what will.  Andre shouldn't have to apologize for Farrakhan's presence since he didn't have anything to do with him being there in the first place.  Nor does Andre need to explain an "association" with Farrakhan that does not exist.   Andre has as much an association with Farrakhan as he does with Mitch Daniels.

Andre Carson has never said or done anything remotely anti-Semitic.  I'm really confused about why we can't assess Andre on his record, acts, and statements, rather than on fairly ignorant speculation.

David vs. Andre's respective qualifications seems like a reasonable debate and one that I would be happy to have, but this Farrakhan business is just being pushed to stir up religious hatred.   That division strengthens Elrod's hand, not David O.'s. All Democrats--even those that prefer David O. to Andre--should remember that.

-Tyrion

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by: Tyrion @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 15:50:14 PM CST

Aye, aye... (0.00 / 0)

What Tyrion said.

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by: Thomas @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:11:32 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Well (0.00 / 0)

Seeing as her funeral was essentially the kickoff rally for Andre for Congress, it's not much of a stretch to assume he had at least some sway with the arrangements.

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:11:49 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Perhaps -- (0.00 / 0)

But unless I see evidence to support this narrative, I don't think there's much credence to the idea that Andre was somehow in charge of the festivities.

I think you may be giving the Carson "machine" more credit as an organized front than is warranted in this case.

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by: Thomas @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:16:22 PM CST

[ Parent ]

ha! (4.00 / 1)

Any funeral that has multiple sitting members of Congress encouraging Hoosier voters to send Julia's "seed" to Congress is all the evidence I need.

As far as David O, from what I hear he's now reconsidering his run.  He can't run for both the state legislature and Congress, and he isn't sure whether he will be able to defeat the Center Township machine.  If he drops out, there is no hope and we'll be stuck with Carson for 40 years.

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:22:05 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I'm sure David... (2.50 / 2)

...is under quite a bit of pressure to keep that seat.

If we had a bigger House margin, it might be different.

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by: Thomas @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:31:33 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Yes (4.00 / 1)

It will be a tough seat to hold without him.  I'm still considering Woody Myers.  Maybe then Wilson will stop calling me racist.

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:35:23 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I for one... (2.00 / 1)

am glad that David O is right where he is so we can keep things like SJR7 where they need to be...the garbage can.

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by: zcockrum @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 20:53:06 PM CST

[ Parent ]

the weirdest part (4.00 / 1)

...is that buzzcut is insisting that andre should have denied his grandmother's dying wishes regarding how to hold her own funeral!  wtf?

it was her funeral, not his, and her wishes were respected, as they should have been.

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by: stallio @ Thu Jan 24, 2008 at 16:54:51 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I said it before and I will say it again... (2.00 / 2)

If David Duke were "invited" by my grandmother to her funeral, I'd be in the doorway of the funeral home preventing him from getting in.  There are more important things than some old lady's wishes.

If that was his grandmother's wish to have Farakhan there, I really have to question her judgement.  And so should have Andre.

Like I said before, its a rookie mistake, but one that certain individuals on his team seem to be failing to learn from.

Why don't we argue more "substantive issues"?  Because they're not an interesting as Andre's grandmother's dying wish and his religion.  Like it or not, a homegrown African American Muslim is a very rare commodity in America.  I think that he should get used to answering questions that no mainstream candidate would have to answer.  That's just the nature of being so... special.

And, quite frankly, what Andre believes on health care and Iraq is almost irrelevant.  He will be a back bencher that just goes along with the Democrat program.  If you really want to know what Andre thinks on substantive issues, you should look at Nancy Pelosi's website, not Andre's.

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by: Buzzcut @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 07:59:50 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Uh... (4.00 / 2)

Why don't we argue more "substantive issues"?  Because they're not an interesting as Andre's grandmother's dying wish and his religion.  Like it or not, a homegrown African American Muslim is a very rare commodity in America.

Read: "Andre's religion is weird, so we're allowed to make a big deal out of it."

Andre did chime in on the Farrakhan issue. He told anyone who asked after the fact that Farrakhan's presence was a request of his grandmother, it wasn't his choice, and he didn't agree or endorse any of the man's beliefs.

There's absolutely nothing more he could say on the subject, but the fact that he is a self-identified Muslim means that people somehow feel justified in pretending like this is a "big issue" in the campaign.

It's not.

That isn't to say that folks on the right aren't going to make a big deal out of the fact that Muslims are out-of-the-ordinary to them, but it does mean that they are totally off-base.

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by: Thomas @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:09:04 AM CST

[ Parent ]

exactly (4.00 / 2)

andre has addressed this repeatedly, and he will address it again.  but his opponents aren't satisfied, nor will they ever be.  there are still right-wingers at AI refusing to believe that julia invited farrakhan.  

this is not an issue anymore.  it's just a smear.  why should andre have to keep answering the same questions over and over again?

saying that he should get used to these questions is like saying mccain should get used to answering questions about his illegitimate black baby.

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by: stallio @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 08:41:04 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Here's what I know (2.50 / 2)

I agree with buzzcut that if my grandmother invited a minister of hatred and racism to her funeral, and I was using that funeral as my launching pad for a congressional run (or even if I wasn't), I would have vetoed that request, her wishes be damned.

Andre might not be the only member of Carson's family, but I'm sure he's got the most sway.  And if he can't sway his family on such an issue, what makes us think he'll be able to lobby for legislation?

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:24:39 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Perhaps you're right... (3.00 / 3)

...but I'm inclined to think that Julia had the biggest sway, and if it was she who wanted Farrakhan, there wasn't much to be done.

Regardless, I think that this is a dead Trojan horse. It's not only a non-issue, but it is a not-so-subtle way for folks on the extreme right to let out their anti-Muslim rants under the guise of a justifiable distaste toward the NoI.

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by: Thomas @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 09:33:42 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Two Carson-bashers... (1.00 / 1)

It's interesting to note that there are only 2 folk here that keep hollering F_A_R_R_A_K_H_A_N continuously: one is a wingnut from Lake County, the other is a Blue Dog "Democrat" who is backing GOP candidate Elrod.

Real Democrats find it a non-issue...

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by: Wilson46201 @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 11:50:11 AM CST

"Real Democrats"... (4.00 / 2)

...don't make up the entire electorate.

Judging from your reaction, F_A_R_A_K_H_A_N is a pretty effective charge.

Wingnut?  Come now, I'm clearly a hex nut.

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by: Buzzcut @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 12:44:20 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Two Carson bashers... (4.00 / 2)

...and some people who will hold their nose and pull the D lever.

But nobody likes your boy too much here, Wilson.  I'd take Thomas' opinion seriously if I were you.  He seems rather... unenthusiastic.

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by: Buzzcut @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 12:47:16 PM CST

[ Parent ]

The only person with balls in Andre's campaign... (2.67 / 3)

...is a woman!

This issue will not die as much as Carson's campaign wishes it would. Carson's defense, according to his campaign treasurer Erin Rosenberg, is that it was his grandmother's dying wish that Farrakhan speak at her funeral. Rosenberg, incidentally, was the only person to walk out on Farrakhan's speech during the funeral.

Now that's someone I can respect.  If Andre had done that, this would not be an issue.

Rosenberg is the "jewish treasurer" that the Andreistas like to bring up.

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by: Buzzcut @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 13:05:28 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Blug Dogs beware. (2.50 / 2)

I appreciate Blue Dogs and recognize what an important role they play in the Democratic party, but any Blue Dog that supports Elrod has it exactly backwards.  I haven't seen any evidence that Elrod wouldn't immediately support the GOP's regressive taxation policies, the Flat Tax, so-called Fair Tax, tax cuts for the rich, etc.  My guess is Elrod will try to hide behind his moderate social views in hopes that people of the 7th won't look too closely at exactly why he's a Republican.  But Indiapolis won't support the Bush agenda; we are Democrats, and we will vote Democratic in March, May and November.

ELLSWORTH FOR SENATE 2010

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by: Mario Cuomo @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 16:12:13 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Desperate for GOP affirmation (4.00 / 1)

So desperate to be affirmed by the Republican party that has again and again used bigotry against gays and every other minority as a party platform staple, homosexual blogger Gary Welsh warps political realities to the point that one has to wonder if Welsh actually lives in the dream world he's constructed on his blog, Advance Indiana.

Jon Elrod refuses to discriminate against gays.  That's great, but it doesn't change the fact that he is affiliated with a party that thrives on such discrimination, and an Elrod victory would be one more seat toward the advancement of those policies.

Completely ignoring this reality, Welsh prefers to focus on Farrakhan's attendance of Julia's funeral.  Farrakhan has made indefensible comments in the past, but both Julia and Andre's support of the LGBT community is resolute and undeniable. Farrakhan is not indicative of the Democratic party any more than Elrod is indicative of the Republican party.  At the end of the day, national Republicans will not support Elrob because he is a moderate voice of change within the party, but rather becuase he is the best chance Republicans have of taking a seat away from Democrats.

Welsh and his ilk need to wake up and acknowledge the larger picture.  The Democratic party is the party that supports minorities.  The Republican party uses them as ploys for votes.  Elrod won't change any of that.

ELLSWORTH FOR SENATE 2010

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by: Mario Cuomo @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 15:54:04 PM CST

Elrod's first vote (2.50 / 2)

in the Legislature was for anti-LGBT Brian Bosma, the GOP SJR-7 panderer.

Elrod's first vote in Congress (G*d forbid!) would be for the fiercely anti-LGBT Republican leadership of John Boehner et al.

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by: Wilson46201 @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 16:02:43 PM CST

[ Parent ]

I hear you. (1.50 / 2)

Elrod as a moderate is a total farce, and I wouldn't trust him as far as I can throw him.  I don't care how anyone feels about the so-called Carson "machine", the 7th is the most Democratic district in Indiana, and we will not staunch Indiana's new trend of sending Democrats to Congress.  Democratic in March, May and November!

ELLSWORTH FOR SENATE 2010

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by: Mario Cuomo @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 16:16:06 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Exactly (2.50 / 2)

Rock on, Mario.  

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by: Tyrion @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 16:29:36 PM CST

[ Parent ]

One table at the Columbia Club (0.00 / 0)

could accomodate the combined meetings of Black Republicans, Jewish Republicans and LGBT Republicans. That gathering might last 5 minutes until they started insulting each other with snipes and slurs -- plates and silverware would be flying after 10 minutes...

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by: Wilson46201 @ Fri Jan 25, 2008 at 21:05:33 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Watch the labels (2.50 / 2)

Calling progressives blue dogs will only anger your progressive opponents.  In fact, because of that insult I am going to work twice as hard to get my friends out to get Elrod temporarily elected and destabilize this entire facade.  You would be surprised at how easy it is to do.  I can see that I will be just as poorly represented by Carson as I will be by Elrod.  

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by: Carlo @ Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 00:49:41 AM CST

Blue Dog "progressives" (0.00 / 0)

No progressive would ever vote for a "fiscally-conservative" Right-To-Lifer Republican who studiously avoids any criticism of George Bush's War in Iraq.

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by: Wilson46201 @ Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 07:15:29 AM CST

[ Parent ]

white Dem suppo0rt for Andre (0.00 / 0)

I am a white Dem in the 7th and I am voting for Andre Carson....he is qualified and will represent all of the district just as his grandmother did.  Most of my white Demo friends are voting for Andre also..so this is not just a black thing or a Wilson thing.....it is for all of us in the 7th...it is so we have a voice to speak up against the dangerous policies of George Bush....we dont even know where Elrod stands on Bush's war on Iraq.....

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by: Blue Beard @ Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 07:21:30 AM CST

Good gawdddddddd... (0.00 / 0)

For those who may be interested...the halftime score is 0-0 in the Newcastle v. Arsenal game.

I think that everyone here could benefit from some hot chocolate and a decent half of English football.

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by: Thomas @ Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 10:04:59 AM CST

You should be proud! (0.00 / 0)

I think this is the busiest thread on BlueIndiana EVER.

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 10:07:57 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Ha... (0.00 / 0)

Yes, that's true.

I guess I always sort of envisioned it being a thread bashing Republicans instead of one another, though.

In the least, you folks could throw in a sideways jab at Gary Welsh every once in a while. I think that's what this thread was about at one point.

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by: Thomas @ Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 10:09:20 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Wait until after March (0.00 / 0)

I think things will get much better after March 11.  Unless Elrod wins and people around here will blame me.  Man, I'd be so powerful.

Thankfully I'll be out of the country from mid-February until March 10.  I hope I get back in time to vote.

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 10:20:32 AM CST

[ Parent ]

You DID NOT just recommend that we watch SOCCER?!? (0.00 / 0)

Dude, Democrats already have issues with voters for being too... effemenate?  Elitist?  Un-American?  Is there a word that better describes soccer?  Something like that.  I'm at a bit of a loss.

Another word comes to mind: boring.  If I was having trouble sleeping, a soccer match would rival Ambien in its effectiveness.

Sorry, I'm an ass to slam your candidate AND your sport, on your website no less!

My 4 year old is starting soccer this spring, maybe my bad attitude will change.  My 6 year old was never interested, he went straight to baseball.

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by: Buzzcut @ Mon Jan 28, 2008 at 09:10:14 AM CST

[ Parent ]

I won't pretend to have a long-term attachment... (0.00 / 0)

...to the sport, but I've been following the English leagues for the last year or so. The addition of the Fox Soccer Channel and pirated internet television has only enhanced my newfound love of the sport.

It's an acquired taste, perhaps, but it beats the hell out of baseball in my book.

I'm horrible out on the pitch personally. Your 4-year-old could probably take me.

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by: Thomas @ Mon Jan 28, 2008 at 09:26:50 AM CST

[ Parent ]

So... (0.00 / 0)

If I watch soccer, that makes me gay?

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Mon Jan 28, 2008 at 09:48:03 AM CST

[ Parent ]

By way of diversion... (0.00 / 0)

...I did read a really interesting article a while back about how soccer in Europe is a decidedly masculine affair, almost to the point of latent anti-homosexuality. This was all within the context of rumors that one of the best football players in Europe -- Thierry Henry -- was possibly gay himself.

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by: Thomas @ Mon Jan 28, 2008 at 10:05:36 AM CST

[ Parent ]

It's bigger than American football (0.00 / 0)

Those guys need more endurance and are generally in a lot better shape though.

Hoosier Progressive

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by: Vox Populi @ Mon Jan 28, 2008 at 14:29:14 PM CST

[ Parent ]

Dane Mahern rumor (0.00 / 0)

The rumor is all over that Dane Mahern has reconsidered and will not run for house district #97       maybe Dane can count after all.....

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by: Blue Beard @ Sat Jan 26, 2008 at 16:21:25 PM CST

How certain are you of this? (0.00 / 0)

I haven't heard it myself, but I'm not well connected to the Indy scene.

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by: Thomas @ Mon Jan 28, 2008 at 09:27:21 AM CST

[ Parent ]

Mahern rumor (0.00 / 0)

I've heard it too...

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by: Wilson46201 @ Mon Jan 28, 2008 at 13:40:48 PM CST

[ Parent ]